Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

When it works against Mexico it’s great? We very nearly pulled it off but we didn’t . Heads high boys
Mexico have about ⅛th of the attacking quality Argentina do.
Its like watching Brentford get through it against Colchester and then trying the same against City.
We didn't "nearly pull it off" either. We conceded twice.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

England had Argentina on the ropes.

Landed a punch

Then covered up on the ropes and hopes not to be knocked out.


Crazy tactics.
Even sat at home it was sooo predictable what was going to happen. How could someone with all of Tuchel’s experience not see that?
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Well I thought all of his substitution and changes throughout the majority of the tournament were spot on
Even his terrible subs against Norway?

I can tell you that if Phil Giles was the England DoF then Tuchel would have got a massive b***ocking for that. Like he would have got this evening too.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Repeat of Croatia in the World Cup and Italy in the Euros. No confidence to get it over the line. When you are shipping chances, the last thing is to invite more pressure. Get up the pitch. So deep we were almost in row F. A lot of that is on Tuchel.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Chins up, an important third place play off to come. A podium finish still on 🙄
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

What I will blame the players for is that our crossed were sh1t all night. Did we actually have any other shot on goal, other than our goal?

Argentina had more decent crosses in 10 mins near the end than we had the entire match.
.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Joe Hart seems to be saying similar now and suggesting Tuchel wanted to go for the second goal, but the players failed to execute instructions, and he then went ultra defensive as a result.
I don’t buy that at all. Kane was obviously spent not long after our goal, Tuchel made the subs not the players and we ended up with well over half a team of defenders on the pitch because of him, not anyone else. It’s a staggering and indefensible failure of management. He had every opportunity to change it after his first substitution left the Argies calving out chance after chance before the hydration break and his response was to double down, bring on more defenders and concede even more of the pitch to them.

It was so glaringly obvious what was going to happen and he stood and watched it unfold.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Desperately trying to cling on was never going to work. Totally surrendered the initiative. Poor tactical choice by Tuchel.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

At leat we know now why Ivan was selected, big lad up front to try and win a header when we're f***ed. Genius.
He might also get his chance in the third place playoffs or whatever they call it that no one gives a damn about.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

@OptaJoe
2 - There are just two occasions of a team scoring first in the semi-final but not reaching the final of the FIFA World Cup in the 21st century – both of them are England (vs Croatia in 2018 and Argentina in 2026).
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

At leat we know now why Ivan was selected, big lad up front to try and win a header when we're f***ed. Genius.
Yes. He took Dan Burn to be "specialist" beanpole in defence to hold a lead and Ivan to be the "specialist" when chasing.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

He might also get his chance in the third place playoffs or whatever they call it that no one gives a damn about.
The 2nd XI play in that game. I expect Jordan Henderson to start.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

@OptaJoe
2 - There are just two occasions of a team scoring first in the semi-final but not reaching the final of the FIFA World Cup in the 21st century – both of them are England (vs Croatia in 2018 and Argentina in 2026).
Game knowledge. We don’t have it. Add in Italy in the Euros.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

What?
Are you defending Argentinas lovely tactics?
I must apologise for my personal reaction to you. However I have no truck with other nations and embrace them all. Regarding the Argentinian football team (I refuse to call them Argies a term coined during the disgraceful Falklands conflict by the likes of The Sun, Mail, Express,etc). With regard to the game Argentina are masters of the dark arts and like many of us who've played a bit we were always told get in early and let them know you're there ! After the first twenty, twenty- five minutes they did just that then they took control and showed what they are really capable of and in the end outplayed us. Roll on Spurs in August.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Thought Rice stayed on for too long in the second half as he looked cream crackered, Had Jordan not phucked the high jump he may have had an on field experience.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

@OptaJoe
2 - There are just two occasions of a team scoring first in the semi-final but not reaching the final of the FIFA World Cup in the 21st century – both of them are England (vs Croatia in 2018 and Argentina in 2026).

It's who we are mate....
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

If you're going backs to the wall you NEED to have some pace up front. Either you take Rogers off and keep Gordon on, or Kane comes off for Rashford/Watkins.
Kane, Bellingham and Rogers breaking from deep does not offer enough threat. Amazing players, but not when played like that
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

we had plenty of warning , Pickford was making saves after save and they hit the post. You can’t give Messi that space and time. It’s like we wanted to play counter attack football without the attacking part.

Who knows whether the manager got it wrong or the players just didn’t follow instructions but either wait it was a massive error, not like the Argies have been giving up in every game before. We knew the onslaught was coming. Total complete loss of the midfield and surrender of possession did us.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Thought Rice stayed on for too long in the second half as he looked cream crackered, Had Jordan not phucked the high jump he may have had an on field experience.
I know Rice hasn't been well but I maintain he is a very over rated player. Anderson put in twice the shift tonight.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Inexplicable tactics. Why not just continue with what we were already doing that was working? We were winning after all.

Smacks of overthinking to me
This. We will never win anything until this mentality is eradicated. I just don’t know why it infects our whole set up, even when changing managers.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Why is it?

when we took a lead against the world class Chelsea in the FA Cup at Griffin Park...at HT jmf said to me that we must continue to attack. Do you really think he was wrong looking at the outcome of that match and this match?
Honestly? I suspect the outcome is similar in either scenario. Im not sure who we could have brought on that could have provided a bit more of a threat. Fitness was also clearly a bit of an issue.

But the changes were clearly a gamble that didn't pay off.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

When it works against Mexico it’s great? We very nearly pulled it off but we didn’t . Heads high boys
This was a little different. 10 men against Mexico was the right call. Not at 1-0 up with 11 men in a World Cup semi final after just scoring. It was terrible from Tuchel
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

I know Rice hasn't been well but I maintain he is a very over rated player. Anderson put in twice the shift tonight.
I think Rice has been running on empty for a long time this season.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

I think what makes it all the more gutting is that before the game a prediction of an England win wasn't solely based on hope. We do have a better team than them, man for man. I believe that.

Kane at his height, Belligham's been brilliant, Pickford has made some great saves. It just felt like everything was coming together.

People are saying we got lucky against Mexico, haven't played well all tournament. Can I remind you that Argentina barely made it past Cape Verde, let alone Egypt. But that wasn't seen as luck?

But that's the difference. I know the words mentality, winning instinct are cliches that often don't mean much, but if you're 1 up in a world cup semi final and your first thought is to conserve it, how can you expect to win it? Okay Argentina have fallen behind in their last game and today, but if that's what it takes to wake them up and to win, then so be it.

Unless we find a way of genuinely being able to outplay and go into games against the best feeling we can win, the 60 year wait might as well be 80.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Even his terrible subs against Norway?

I can tell you that if Phil Giles was the England DoF then Tuchel would have got a massive b***ocking for that. Like he would have got this evening too.
I don't see where Phil Giles and his b***ockings come into it I'm afraid. In the end the final third we played was dismal but the broader point which I am trying, and seemingly failing, to make us that this is football, you tend to lose the big games more than you win, and that despite this failure Tuchel remains the right man to deliver international success. Of course this is contentious, I may be catastrophically wrong, but my view is that I do rather hope the FA is not overly trigger happy in this instance.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Honestly? I suspect the outcome is similar in either scenario. Im not sure who we could have brought on that could have provided a bit more of a threat. Fitness was also clearly a bit of an issue.

But the changes were clearly a gamble that didn't pay off.
Changes shouldn't be a gamble though should they? This is a world cup final, we shouldn't be winging it.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

We lost it when he went 5 at the back.
At the start we had Spence at left back and Gordon dropping into help, they barely ctossed a ball for the first 60 minutes because we closed them down.
Then he takes Gordon off for Konsa, goes 5 at the back and all of a sudden Spence is being double and triple teamed with nobody taking responsibility of helping him and them crossing it at will.
Surely Tuchel should have seen that and sorted it.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Interesting Kane saying the suggestion from the bench was to keep going for the second goal.
I think, at a certain point, we need to blame the players not the manager.
I think we had an on-pitch leadership failure and bottled it.
It’s easier to sit back when it’s not going well than be brave and attack them back.
I completely agree that we need to question the players as much as their coaches (as Redknapp said, once the game starts there's only so much a manager can do).

But do you raelly bring off Gordon for Konsa when going for a second goal? As a player, if I saw a coach do that, I'd question whether they truly believe we can pull this off. It's demotivating and you saw that in the players
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Honestly? I suspect the outcome is similar in either scenario. Im not sure who we could have brought on that could have provided a bit more of a threat. Fitness was also clearly a bit of an issue.

But the changes were clearly a gamble that didn't pay off.
Rashford. Saka. Toney. Keep Gordon on. Madueke. Watkins.

If you can honestly look at that England bench and say "I'm not sure who we could've brought on to provide more of a threat" than subbing on Dan Burn and Ezri Konsa then I'm sorry but, respectfully, you need a new past-time
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

Unfortunately we decided to give this bozo a new contact, which seemed mainly due to beating world beaters Serbia in the qualifiers.
 

Full Time: England 1 (Gordon) Argentina 2

England had Argentina on the ropes.

Landed a punch

Then covered up on the ropes and hopes not to be knocked out.


Crazy tactics.


Yup

I thought Tuchel was going to lose whilst trying to win. But it was Gareth all over again

Argentina will foul you off the pitch for 70 mins with no punishment to soften you up, then they will stab their own children to get a goal right up to the last second.

We bring on 3 defenders and invite Messi and his mates into our penalty area for 35 mins, after the second Argie goal the ball was in play 1 minute, why can’t we do that.

Kane is one of the best in the world, but when we are playing 9 defenders we need someone who can hold it up, run, fight scrap, earn corners and free kicks and shot house. He stands on the edge of our area and kicks it straight back to them. He doesn’t win headers or 50/50’s when he is on his own.

I just don’t get it, no way were we surviving that onslaught, Tuchel does realise these aren’t German defenders doesn’t he

I agree, we had them on the ropes and they were devoid of ideas and Messi was being robbed like a school kid.
 
Back
Top Bottom