Final Score Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

1-1 FT.

We almost did enough, but can't really say we deserved the win and all the stats back that up.

Ref gave them far too much, but looking at it objectively, he got the Jaidon disallowed goal right (2 hands on the ball) and the pen right (arms around, not looking at the ball and contact made). Some will say it's soft, but KLP gave the ref a decision to make. Wouldn't have been surprised if we had got a pen in similar circumstances.

Basically, Sunderland stopped us playing and did their homework. And too many of our players were under par first half.

Feels like 2 points dropped but it will do our exciting team some good to keep their feet on the ground and work harder.
We didn’t deserve to win, so it’s more like a point gained in my opinion, sad to say.

It was quite a bold decision to make those tactical subs at half time, but a good one. It looked to me like there was a bit of glaring between our players on top of the poor performances in the first half, so it needed a shake up. We’ve got a deeper squad this season, so, as you say, no one can count their chickens.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Did I imagine it or did they get a freekick because Dan Ballard blocked a shot with his head?

I'm afraid you didn't imagine it.

We questioned that at the time as well



“Multi quote” telling off incoming, but.

The game was stopped for a head injury, if there is a head injury in the penalty the ball is automatically handed to the keeper.

The most ridiculous rule in the history of football. Their bloke literally got straight back up, if the ref waited 2-3 seconds then we are attacking again, but I expect had the ref not blown he would have stayed down rolling about.

It’s a sh*t rule and one that many teams have used to cheat to their advantage. Wolves did it 2-3 times last year, we were in their penalty area, winning headers and in possession, their player falls over holding his head, whistle goes and the ball is handed to the keeper.

I understand not wanting to drop the ball to an attacking team 6 yards from goal, so just drop it 10 yards outside the area.

It’s a terrible rule completely open to abuse and used by sh*thousing teams.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

KLP got away with a very similar incident against Spurs. Very foolish frankly, and it justifies the decision to bring in a taller, more physical left back. You have to give credit to Sunderland for coming at us so aggressively, but I don't enjoy their style of play.
Yes, KLP gives away that kind of foul quite often. He always looks mystified when they're given but refs keep giving them. Maybe he ought to learn and cut them out.

(That said, I thought it was soft at the time and I haven't seen a replay yet. I reserve the right to get annoyed when I have!)
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Yes, KLP gives away that kind of foul quite often. He always looks mystified when they're given but refs keep giving them. Maybe he ought to learn and cut them out.

(That said, I thought it was soft at the time and I haven't seen a replay yet. I reserve the right to get annoyed when I have!)
Equally, he gave away a goal last season when he went over under (not a lot of) pressure, which he could easily have done today given the attacker was pushing him. He has troubke defending in the box, pretty much his only weakness, but one teams seem to play on.

Draw probably about right. Fair play to them for their first half, we were outthought as much as out played. But the rolling around ... that Danso was one of the main offenders suggests it is coached, nd the ref really should have got hold of that early on.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

I concluded at the time that there must have been another offence because he couldn’t be ‘that f***ing stupid’
I’m probably wrong, but I thought an offside had been called. That’s purely based on the linesman’s positioning as he looked liked he was instructing where it should be taken.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

The attackers arm is fully wrapped around KLP.

Why isn’t this mutual holding? Why did the officiating team not consider whether this impacted KLPs ability to face the ball?

View attachment 68749

Your reminder that we didn’t get a penalty for this rugby tackle on Collins v Spurs which was described as a ‘slight pull.’

View attachment 68750

@Untouchable, KLP has had a wonderful start to the season. He's improving year on year. But that single moment was nothing but foolish. Whilst the attacker is holding him, the evidence you've given also shows KLP giving him a massive hug, his hands are around his neck for christ sake!

Play the ball, back yourself to win the duel. At least then you've got a much stronger claim for a foul against you. There's absolutely no intention at all to follow the ball, none. It's reckless and we've been punished for it. But he'll learn from this, cut it out!
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

@Untouchable, KLP has had a wonderful start to the season. He's improving year on year. But that single moment was nothing but foolish. Whilst the attacker is holding him, the evidence you've given also shows KLP giving him a massive hug, his hands are around his neck for christ sake!

Play the ball, back yourself to win the duel. At least then you've got a much stronger claim for a foul against you. There's absolutely no intention at all to follow the ball, none. It's reckless and we've been punished for it. But he'll learn from this, cut it out!
...KLP isn't a defender...never will be..he doesn't understand what it is to be a defender... it's an attackers foul on an attacker.... defenders attack the ball with their head....KLP will never ever win defensive headers.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

...KLP isn't a defender...never will be..he doesn't understand what it is to be a defender... it's an attackers foul on an attacker.... defenders attack the ball with their head....KLP will never ever win defensive headers.

That’s how I see it. And. He is small.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Did I imagine it or did they get a freekick because Dan Ballard blocked a shot with his head?
Certainly looked that way to me.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

...KLP isn't a defender...never will be..he doesn't understand what it is to be a defender... it's an attackers foul on an attacker.... defenders attack the ball with their head....KLP will never ever win defensive headers.
Most aspects of his defensive play are excellent. Defending crosses and corners aren’t his strong point. The challenge today was naive and he gave the ref no choice.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

...it wasn't defending....KA knows it.
It wasn’t. If he was 6 foot, he can react differently to a ball in like that. As said, he’s not a natural defender. Tbf, he’s made a great fist of the position for some time now.
 
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Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Most aspects of his defensive play are excellent. Defending crosses and corners aren’t his strong point. The challenge today was naive and he gave the ref no choice.
... funnily enough...as a one time defender myself...and as a defender... heading the ball from time to time was part of my job...if you can't head a ball...clear your lines....you shouldn't be there.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

It wasn’t. If he was 6 foot, he can react differently to a ball in like that. As said, he’s not a natural defender. Tbf, he’s made a great fist of the position for some time now.
..... nobody is questioning his ability....but not watching the ball is not what defenders do....you watch the ball...not the man you are marking.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

..... nobody is questioning his ability....but not watching the ball is not what defenders do....you watch the ball...not the man you are marking.
Not sure about that tbf. Defenders defend by whatever means. The good ones are more subtle….
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Tell that to every single defender in the premier league at every single corner.
....watch what KLP did....he can't call himself a defender doing that... neither can KA.... remind me why we got the fella in from WHU.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Not sure about that tbf. Defenders defend by whatever means. The good ones are more subtle….
... he's not a good one obviously....where subtlety reigns🤨
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

How come they choose to swap ends AND took the KO?
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Haven't read above yet, gonna say what I saw without influence then read back.

A couple of chaps on the other thread (think @Argus and a couple others) declared Leeds to be a better team than Sunderland before a ball was kicked, based on absolutely nothing whatsover. It felt a little like this was coming, big expectation and a big build up to beating Sunderland at home and IMO we were lucky to come out with a point.

Sunderland were incredible first half, they're cheating bastards there's no doubt about that but they cut through us like butter time and time again. Sangare was nowhere to be seen, Damsgaard huffed and puffed and Janelt was just about keeping it together. The goal disallowed in the first half I think was correct, i'd be a llitle annoyed if I was a Sunderland fan but in all fairness I don't see how the keeper can save it with the lad in the offside position, so fair call. Also justice for the cheating bastard that won them the free kick. Sunderland 1st half against us were like us first half against Leeds (with added cheating), let's just own that.

Loved Keith's subs second half, very brave and flexing what a squad we have. We looked better immediately with Yarmo covering more ground than Sangare and Anthony proving more of a direct threat than Dango. The goal kinda came out of nothing, what an incredible finish from a player that costs about 20 quid in todays standards. I said to my mrs we needed a 2nd because we've seen this before.... and I thought we had it! Did he kick it out of the keepers 2 hands? I guess so but it seemed to be resolved so quickly that it felt soft.

KLP was a bit of an enigma today, most positive attacking wise came from him but he felt like a defensive mistake waiting to happen. Again may be a little soft but it's a penalty these days, thats why it wasn't overturned. I think he may just have lost his place to the new LB tho.

After this, it felt like it could go either way. I feel the ref at this point had lost all control, so many soft fouls being given and he totally ruined the flow of the game. I thought he was really poor for the game, but ironically may have got the bigger decisions right. What a hand full and a nightmare Brobby continues to be for Sunderland, reminds me of Clayton Donaldson for us in League One.

I think we got away with one, maybe a bit of a reality check too. Yes we're good, but I said in my prediction at the beginning of the season that we're top 8 with a decent run without injuries, a few key injuries tho and we could be bottom half.

We desperately miss Jensen, he's so key to unleashing Outtara, Thiago and Schade. Collins will be a big miss too if it's serious.

Massive shoutout to Schuster. A really tough game to come into and he held his own... really impressed with the kid.

A reminder that there's no easy games in this league for a few that forgot. Having said that, we have as much chance of winning against Bournemouth as Sunderland did against us. All to play for and unbeaten so far this season, we'll take that for certain.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

@Untouchable, KLP has had a wonderful start to the season. He's improving year on year. But that single moment was nothing but foolish. Whilst the attacker is holding him, the evidence you've given also shows KLP giving him a massive hug, his hands are around his neck for christ sake!

Play the ball, back yourself to win the duel. At least then you've got a much stronger claim for a foul against you. There's absolutely no intention at all to follow the ball, none. It's reckless and we've been punished for it. But he'll learn from this, cut it out!
Exactly, it's a clear foul, it's not even a debate. I've been a defender for many years (not at pro level of course) but if I defend like that I know there's every chance i'll concede a penalty and you run the risk. At my level you get away with it, but even if the ref missed that one, I think VAR picks it up and gives it.
 
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Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

??

The penalty wasn't wrong.
The Anthony kicking the ball out of the goalkeeper's hands wasn't wrong.
Their disallowed goal wasn't wrong.

What else was there?
Facts: it was a pen. Ridiculous defending and one he should be lambasted before behind the scenes. Yes we should have had a pen v Leeds.
Their disallowed goal was harsh but probably right call.
JA's goal was rightly disallowed.
They were miles better than us overall. Miles.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

You said it yourself. 'You make it happen.' We didn't make much happen. Sunderland created more chances. More shots, more shots on target and better xG. The ref is not the reason we failed to win. Lots of falling about, yes, but the big calls were correct.

People really need to get over blaming refs when it doesn't go our way. It's like cry wolf - one time when a really awful performance costs us points, criticism is worthless, because we hear it all the time.
Could not agree more. Sunderland deserved to win. We were lucky to get a point. They were, quite few not, far far better prepared and on their game. We were not.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Another Yorkshire referee, who spoilt the game!
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

For me:

Ref had 3 big moments and got them all correct
  1. The Sunderland disallowed goal
  2. The Brentford disallowed goal
  3. The penalty.
The rest of the reffing I can't say I am so certain about.
EDIT

He actually got #1 wrong, but VAR helped him out

So ref got 2/3 correct
and Proref for 3/3 correct.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Wtf refereeing performance did I just watch? When their player went down, I started laughing it was so bad. And then when I realised the ref gave it, I couldn't stop laughing at the stupidity of the decision. Now I'm just proper fecked off. Referee spoilt the game entirely.
First half we were rubbish.
Second half, much better.
Don't think that ref should ever be allowed to ref games again. I don't care for any opinion that disagrees with me. Watching it live, it was a terrible decision. Amongst many many many awful decisions.
Usually, when people complain about the ref, there’s a touch of sour grapes in it, but I agree with you, he was dreadful. Talk about wanting to be the centre of attention! Poor tackles throughout the whole match went unpunished, yet the slightest touches penalised. How many var referrals were there? The first one took ages! I took one look at it and it was blatant. What the hell took them so long? It was stop start the whole game.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

I dunno if there is a thread for this but what’s with the increasing queues at the stadium. Seem to be getting longer every week and tailing back filling Lionel Road South.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Woke up wondering if maybe we have a bit of a sickness bug in the camp.
Too many players well off the pace for it to be a coincidence?
Think Sunderland were just better than us, we were caught off guard. We looked similar first half v Sunderland to the Leeds game in the 2nd half tbh.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Think Sunderland were just better than us, we were caught off guard. We looked similar first half v Sunderland to the Leeds game in the 2nd half tbh.

I don’t disagree at all.
I just think some players seemed to lack their usual energy.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

“Multi quote” telling off incoming, but.

The game was stopped for a head injury, if there is a head injury in the penalty the ball is automatically handed to the keeper.

The most ridiculous rule in the history of football. Their bloke literally got straight back up, if the ref waited 2-3 seconds then we are attacking again, but I expect had the ref not blown he would have stayed down rolling about.

It’s a sh*t rule and one that many teams have used to cheat to their advantage. Wolves did it 2-3 times last year, we were in their penalty area, winning headers and in possession, their player falls over holding his head, whistle goes and the ball is handed to the keeper.

I understand not wanting to drop the ball to an attacking team 6 yards from goal, so just drop it 10 yards outside the area.

It’s a terrible rule completely open to abuse and used by sh*thousing teams.
Should have to go off the pitch for assessment and not be able to return for at least a minute. Say as every other injury should be
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Woke up wondering if maybe we have a bit of a sickness bug in the camp.
Too many players well off the pace for it to be a coincidence?
That is possible - some of the first half problems (Kayode giving #10 acres of space, the massive gaps in midfield) could have been sorted with some shouting from the bench rather than hooking two of the (usually) most dynamic players. Damsgaard looked heavy legged to me too.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

@Untouchable, KLP has had a wonderful start to the season. He's improving year on year. But that single moment was nothing but foolish. Whilst the attacker is holding him, the evidence you've given also shows KLP giving him a massive hug, his hands are around his neck for christ sake!

Play the ball, back yourself to win the duel. At least then you've got a much stronger claim for a foul against you. There's absolutely no intention at all to follow the ball, none. It's reckless and we've been punished for it. But he'll learn from this, cut it out!
Didn’t he give away a free kick for doing the same thing earlier in the 2nd half as well? Didn’t learn from it as he then did the same thing to give away the pen.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

EDIT

He actually got #1 wrong, but VAR helped him out

So ref got 2/3 correct
and Proref for 3/3 correct.
VAR told him to look at #1 then he got it right. It's the sort of decision a ref should be using VAR for, very hard to judge that on the pitch.

Even without any of these moments though the ref was awful. The media always highlight the big moments but it's when a ref drags the game into the mud through regular incompetence that most fans gets upset.
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Ajer didn’t pass the ball to him once I think - but Collins was not having a good game and I think that actually the back line looked better with Schuster in it.

Although I do agree that you are very good at spotting nonsense comments. GIven how many you make. 😂


Yup, I have just spotted another one
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

Haven't read above yet, gonna say what I saw without influence then read back.

A couple of chaps on the other thread (think @Argus and a couple others) declared Leeds to be a better team than Sunderland before a ball was kicked, based on absolutely nothing whatsover. It felt a little like this was coming, big expectation and a big build up to beating Sunderland at home and IMO we were lucky to come out with a point.

Sunderland were incredible first half, they're cheating bastards there's no doubt about that but they cut through us like butter time and time again. Sangare was nowhere to be seen, Damsgaard huffed and puffed and Janelt was just about keeping it together. The goal disallowed in the first half I think was correct, i'd be a llitle annoyed if I was a Sunderland fan but in all fairness I don't see how the keeper can save it with the lad in the offside position, so fair call. Also justice for the cheating bastard that won them the free kick. Sunderland 1st half against us were like us first half against Leeds (with added cheating), let's just own that.

Loved Keith's subs second half, very brave and flexing what a squad we have. We looked better immediately with Yarmo covering more ground than Sangare and Anthony proving more of a direct threat than Dango. The goal kinda came out of nothing, what an incredible finish from a player that costs about 20 quid in todays standards. I said to my mrs we needed a 2nd because we've seen this before.... and I thought we had it! Did he kick it out of the keepers 2 hands? I guess so but it seemed to be resolved so quickly that it felt soft.

KLP was a bit of an enigma today, most positive attacking wise came from him but he felt like a defensive mistake waiting to happen. Again may be a little soft but it's a penalty these days, thats why it wasn't overturned. I think he may just have lost his place to the new LB tho.

After this, it felt like it could go either way. I feel the ref at this point had lost all control, so many soft fouls being given and he totally ruined the flow of the game. I thought he was really poor for the game, but ironically may have got the bigger decisions right. What a hand full and a nightmare Brobby continues to be for Sunderland, reminds me of Clayton Donaldson for us in League One.

I think we got away with one, maybe a bit of a reality check too. Yes we're good, but I said in my prediction at the beginning of the season that we're top 8 with a decent run without injuries, a few key injuries tho and we could be bottom half.

We desperately miss Jensen, he's so key to unleashing Outtara, Thiago and Schade. Collins will be a big miss too if it's serious.

Massive shoutout to Schuster. A really tough game to come into and he held his own... really impressed with the kid.

A reminder that there's no easy games in this league for a few that forgot. Having said that, we have as much chance of winning against Bournemouth as Sunderland did against us. All to play for and unbeaten so far this season, we'll take that for certain.
I find it funny how fans see things. 'sunderland are cheating bastards' !
Like last season, I find Brentford probably the dirtiest team in the league. Not violent, but sly pushes and holding all over the pitch - and really Brentford should have had players sent off who were on a yellow for more holding (professional fouls).
Great game though, happy with a point as I think Brentford will be a top 8 team this season.
Hopefully we will have a better ref at the SOL as today he was pretty poor. When Collins ran into and tried to push brobbey and ended getting injured and then getting a free kick is something that we have begun to get used to. Woeful refereeing. And brobbey getting pulled and held in the box - easily a pen in the first half and another instance imo of VAR and refs behaving differently to brobbey than other players.

So Sunderland cheating bastards?! Hmmmmm, when you're getting held and pulled back all over the pitch , it must be frustrating for players and don't think the ref gave us a free kick which wasn't warranted .
 

Brentford 1 (Janelt) Sunderland 1

I find it funny how fans see things. 'sunderland are cheating bastards' !
Like last season, I find Brentford probably the dirtiest team in the league. Not violent, but sly pushes and holding all over the pitch - and really Brentford should have had players sent off who were on a yellow for more holding (professional fouls).
Great game though, happy with a point as I think Brentford will be a top 8 team this season.
Hopefully we will have a better ref at the SOL as today he was pretty poor. When Collins ran into and tried to push brobbey and ended getting injured and then getting a free kick is something that we have begun to get used to. Woeful refereeing. And brobbey getting pulled and held in the box - easily a pen in the first half and another instance imo of VAR and refs behaving differently to brobbey than other players.

So Sunderland cheating bastards?! Hmmmmm, when you're getting held and pulled back all over the pitch , it must be frustrating for players and don't think the ref gave us a free kick which wasn't warranted .
You are literally cheating bastards. As I say, good and well drilled team, but a bunch of cheats no doubt. :sorted:
 
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